Charles H. Spurgeon has an eloquent answer to this question. This is an excerpt taken from “The Downgrade.”
This is from the beginning of the article:
NO lover of the gospel can conceal from himself the fact that the days are evil. We are willing to make a large discount from our apprehensions on the score of natural timidity, the caution of age, and the weakness produced by pain; but yet our solemn conviction is that things are much worse in many churches than they seem to be, and are rapidly tending downward. Read those newspapers which represent the Broad School of Dissent, and ask yourself, How much farther could they go? What doctrine remains to be abandoned? What other truth to be the object of contempt? A new religion has been initiated, which is no more Christianity than chalk is cheese; and this religion, being destitute of moral honesty, palms itself off as the old faith with slight improvements, and on this plea usurps pulpits which were erected for gospel preaching. The Atonement is scouted, the inspiration of Scripture is derided, the Holy Spirit is degraded into an influence, the punishment of sin is turned into fiction, and the resurrection into a myth, and yet these enemies of our faith expect us to call them brethren, and maintain a confederacy with them! Source.
This is from the end of the article:
It now becomes a serious question how far those who abide by the faith once delivered to the saints should fraternize with those who have turned aside to another gospel. Christian love has its claims, and divisions are to be shunned as grievous evils; but how far are we justified in being in confederacy with those who are departing from the truth? It is a difficult question to answer so as to keep the balance of the duties. For the present it behooves believers to be cautious, lest they lend their support and countenance to the betrayers of the Lord. It is one thing to overleap all boundaries of denominational restriction for the truth’s sake: this we hope all godly men will do more and more. It is quite another policy which would urge us to subordinate the maintenance of truth to denominational prosperity and unity. Numbers of easy-minded people wink at error so long as it is committed by a clever man and a good-natured brother, who has so many fine points about him. Let each believer judge for himself; but, for our part, we have put on a few fresh bolts to our door, and we have given orders to keep the chain up; for, under colour of begging the friendship of the servant, there are those about who aim at robbing the Master. Source.
To read everything in between, please visit the source links.
Have you seen the New Age global connections and plans concerning this revival with Todd Bentley? These globalists’ truly believe that the Third Wave and Latter Rain promised by their so-called “prophets” is beginning with Todd Bentley. They think this is the great revival that will usher in a grand new church to rule the world. These streams are all moving together to bring in their prophesied revival to “cleanse the church because they believe it is dirty without God’s power.” In their minds, the blood of Jesus is not strong enough to cleanse it. Using their demonic forces, they will rebuild it on false signs and wonders and the world will flock to them and eventually they will conquer the earth and heaven. As gods, they will ascend to the very throne of God.
We are now the ones who they consider evil. I believe we must stand our ground and expose them. Remember, they are not the church, just a small corner of occultist trying to take it over to change it into their own images. God still has a people and He promised us that the gates of hell would not prevail against HIS CHURCH.
Remember there is a line of division. … Their unbiblical, occult practices and us who believe that Jesus is the Head of His Church, concerned about the souls that they are stealing. Stand and we shall see the glory of Jesus.
New article that shows how these people are connected with the New Age and the Antichrist, end time revival.
AVATAR TODD BENTLEY ~ PETER WAGNER ~ Rick joyner ~ Bentley’s COMING BACK TO LAKELAND JULY 18 ~ THE THIRD WAVE ~ LATTER RAIN ~ KINGDOM NOW ~ ”Manifest Sons,” ”Overcomers,” ”Manchild,” ”Joel’s Army.”
BENTLEY is an instrument in the hands of “living gods.”
THE NEW GODS.’ PREPARATION FOR THE ANTICHRIST.
BENJAMIN CREME, New Age Antichrist forerunner, says, many now expect the return of their awaited Teacher, whether they call him the Christ, Messiah, the fifth Buddha, Krishna, or the Imam Mahdi. Millions now know that the Teacher who fulfills all these expectations is already living among us.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cc4g6UMCATA
THE THIRD WAVE ~ ENTRANCE INTO THE GLOBAL NEW AGE
The expression Third Wave was coined by Christian theologian C. Peter Wagner around 1980 to describe what followers believe to be the recent historical work of the Holy Spirit. It is part of a larger movement known as the Neocharismatic movement. The “Third Wave” involves those Christians who have received Pentecostal-like experiences, however Third Wavers usually claim no close association with either the Pentecostal or Charismatic movements.
“He replied: Watch out that you are not deceived. For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am he,’ and, ‘The time is near.’ Do not follow them,” (Lk. 21:8).
Todd Bentley says, SPIRITUAL ENTITIES & STAR GATES will CREATE SUPER HUMANS “OPEN HEAVENS BRING GOD’S KINGDOM TO EARTH” Then, as heaven manifests in the natural realm, both the rule and the reign of Jesus Christ will be known in the earth. “Let God be glorified!” Yet, don’t miss this: The key to bringing that manifestation to earth is an open heaven—a portal through which the kingdom of God invades the earth!
See m my latest article concerning Todd Bentley’s article about “Opening the Star Gates to the Third Heaven.” http://www.scribd.com/doc/3910877/OPEN-HEAVENS-STAR-GATES-GATEKEEPERS-BRINGING-GODS-KINGDOM-TO-EARTH
http://www.scribd.com/doc/3981062/AVATAR-TODD-BENTLEY-PETER-WAGNER-Rick-Joyner-Bentleys-COMING-BACK-TO-LAKELAND-JULY-18-THIRD-WAVE-LATTER-RAIN-KINGDOM-NOW-Manifest
By: patpat holliday on July 18, 2008
at 12:41 am
As I read it, CHS seems to be saying we should not “fraternize with apostates”.
The only problem is how do we determine who is an apostate. Or, looking at it another way, who has the right to decide what is true doctrine and what is heresy?
Let’s not say “the Bible decides what is truth”, because so many of these questions come down to matters of interpretation.
And I personally see no problem with maintaining relationships with those we disagree with, especially if they are aware of our views on them. This is different to endorsing their beliefs or actions. (I have several friends who are Todd fans).
By: Anonymous on July 20, 2008
at 8:14 am
Read 2 John.
By: Chrystal on July 20, 2008
at 9:38 am
I think you’re referring in particular to 2 John 7-11, which discusses those “who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh”.
As far as I am aware, not even the biggest heretics of the contemporary church fall into this category.
Or maybe I’ve missed something…
By: TruthSeeker on July 20, 2008
at 6:14 pm
But it also goes on to say that those who do not abide in the teaching of Christ… now, I ask you. What did Christ teach while He walked this earth?
Also, here’s more to consider…
Romans 16: 17-18:
17 ¶ Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.
And for those who say we aren’t to judge, this should clear that up:
1 Corinthians 5:9-13:
9 ¶ I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.
11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.
Here’s more to consider:
Galatians 1:6-9:
6 ¶ I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
God’s Word repeatedly tells us that we should separate from those who teach false doctrine and reject them (see Titus 3:5).
You can’t surgically snip those passages out and justify embracing them.
By: Chrystal on July 20, 2008
at 6:40 pm
Chrystal,
You said “God’s Word repeatedly tells us that we should separate from those who teach false doctrine and reject them (see Titus 3:5).”
I agree!
However, after 25 years of faith, as I said in my first post, I have been unable to discover a reliable way of deciding what is true and what is false. The fact is that I can pray, study my Bible, consider the views of other learned and devout Christians, and come to a conclusion on a topic. I could even end up 110% convinced that God has shown me what is “true doctrine”. But another mature believer can do exactly the same thing and come to a different, even opposite, conclusion, and also be convinced that this is what God has showed them. We can’t both be right!
Likewise, I could consult those in spiritual authority over me (ie my church leaders) and they could tell me their views on a particular topic. But I know full well that if I asked the leaders of a different church the same question, I would get a different answer. So that doesn’t help me either!
The history of Christianity (particularly protestant evangelicalism) is littered with groups who believe that they have had a special revelation of the truth and split away from the rest of the church as a result. Even amongst those who claim to take the bible literally, there is a diversity of views and considerable division. What a shambles!
Now I believe that humility is the way of Christ, and I’m not going to be so arrogant to claim that my personal interpretation of the Bible is right and everyone else is wrong. Because, after all, I could be the one who is in error (never!).
Modern thinking in this whole area is more nuanced that you seem to be suggesting (forgive me for saying this, but I have found many Christians see black and white when in reality there are shades of gray). The idea is that there are primary issues over which there has to be agreement before fellowship can take place, and secondary issues where the Bible is unclear and a range of views can be validly deduced, so these should not be a barrier to fellowship.
However, even this is an inadequate approach. What determines a primary or secondary issue? This is frequently a matter of personal preference. What about topics like whether the Bible is inerrant or infallible, whether Calvinism or Arminianism is the correct model, whether the sign gifts of the Holy Spirit are for today, whether worship should be liturgical or not and what styles of music should be used, who should be baptised and how, what form preaching should take, how should we spread the gospel, and how the Church should be governed? These could all be said to be secondary issues, but many people regard them as so important that they refuse to associate with people who hold differing views. A quick look at the contemporary church will easily confirm this.
So, how we apply this Biblical principle is fraught with danger. What’s more, I am convinced that the danger of “shunning” other Christians is far greater than the danger of associating with those who hold different views. Even if we believe them to be in major error, we do far more good by building bridges instead of walls.
Let me finish by bringing this up to date with Lakeland. I believe that Todd Bentley is in major error and I have very serious concerns about his theology and methods. But if I was a prominent Christian leader, I would still, as a minimum, meet and talk with him. I would make my concerns clear and would not share ministry with him, but I wouldn’t break off contact. I would be happy for my views to be made public (in fact, I’d want that so there wouldn’t be misunderstanding).
I do have friends who believe that Lakeland is a work of God, regard Todd as an anointed evangelist, watch him on TV, and align themselves with his ministry. Again, I am not going to walk away from them just because they’ve been deceived by a scheme of the enemy. Where is the love in that?
I’m sorry that this is rather long and hope it makes sense and has been expressed graciously.
By: TruthSeeker on July 21, 2008
at 4:31 am